Cardinal Perspectives: Veterans Day Edition

Welcome to Cardinal Perspectives, a series featuring in-depth conversations with alumni, students, faculty, staff and the extended family and community of The Catholic University of America. We are delighted to introduce this episode featuring Harvey Seegers, Maura Wenzel, Scott Flesch, and Mary Card Mina.

Retired Lieutenant Colonel Harvey Seegers is Senior Associate Dean and Professor of Practice at the Busch School of Business. He is a decorated officer of the U.S. Marine Corps and held significant leadership responsibilities in the South Pacific, Capitol Hill, and the Pentagon. In addition to his 24 years in the Marine Corps, he built an impressive business career, leading General Electric’s e-commerce division and launching HomeDepot.com. He holds degrees from the University of Virginia, Harvard Business School, and Catholic University.

Retired Lieutenant Maura Wenzel is Assistant Clinical Professor at the Conway School of Nursing. She served in the U.S Navy Nurse Corps for eight years—five on active duty and three in the Reserves—and specializes in emergency nursing. Professor Wenzel now brings that hands-on experience to the classroom, preparing the next generation of nurses. She earned her Bachelor of Science in Nursing from Villanova and both her Master of Science in Nursing and Doctor of Nursing Practice from Catholic University.

Retired Major Scott Flesch, who served more than 25 years in the U.S. Army as a Soldier and Civilian, is a member at Miller & Chevalier and was adjunct lecturer at the Columbus School of Law for more than 20 years. A double Cardinal and former President of the Alumni Association Board of Directors, Major Flesch concluded a distinguished Army career as Army Chief Trial Attorney for the U.S. Army, overseeing major government contract litigation. Today, he represents government contractors in complex disputes, protests, counseling, and investigations, continuing his commitment to service through law and education.

This conversation is hosted by Alumni Association President and Retired Lieutenant Colonel Mary Card Mina, who served 22 years as an Army Judge Advocate, including assignments as Assistant Legal Advisor within the Department of Defense’s Office of Military Commissions and Staff Judge Advocate for the Army Materiel Command Legal Center. Mary is a double Cardinal, earning both her Juris Doctor and her Bachelor of Arts in political science from The Catholic University of America. 

And to all the active-duty and retired military personnel listening — thank you for your service and dedication.
 

*This transcript is based on an audio recording and has been lightly edited for readability. It reflects the substance of the conversation but may not be a verbatim record.

Mary Card Mina
I was really struck today when I drove onto campus and saw the welcome sign that says, “Welcome to the Catholic University of America. Founded 1887 in service to Church and nation.” And that's really why we're here today for this Cardinal conversation. All of today’s guests are part of The Catholic University of America as distinguished alums and faculty members, and have served Church and nation.

Thank you for your service. When combined, we're looking at well over probably 70 years of service, which is pretty amazing. In today's conversation, we're going to focus on three themes. The first is service to nation. The second is service to Church, faith, and a combination of the two. And the third is service to The Catholic University of America as faculty members and leaders, and also how Catholic University serves veterans and current ROTC students.

So let's jump in and let's get started with discussing service to nation. I'd like for each of you to share a bit about your career, your military background, and what first drew you to serve. Maura, can we start with you?

Maura Wenzel
Yeah, absolutely. I'm a Navy brat. My dad was in the Navy and so I grew up moving every three, four years. And then my older brother went to the Merchant Marine Academy and joined the Navy.

I was profoundly affected by September 11. It happened when I was 17 years old. I was a junior in high school and I noticed everyone who was running towards the shambles were the first responders and nurses and doctors. I thought, “I want to be part of that.”

I went to my dad and I said, “I want to do something for my country.” And my dad was like, “You're in luck! There's a scholarship called ROTC.” And so then I served in the Navy, was on active duty for five years, active reserves for two years, and then inactivated reserves for one more year.

Mary Card Mina
Wonderful. Thank you again very much for your service. And I have to say, go Army! But today we are all sisters and brothers in service. Thank you. Harvey, how about you?

Harvey Seegers
I was on active duty for 12 years. 12 years in the reserves as well.

I was an infantry officer. And retired as a lieutenant colonel. I would like to say that I was driven by some overwhelming patriotic duty to join the Marine Corps, but the truth of the matter was I really liked their uniforms and I wanted a job outside of college that let me see the world.

And I was very fortunate in that regard. I had several years in the South Pacific and then came back to the States and I had tours of duty in the White House and finally the Pentagon.

Mary Card Mina
Great, thank you. We have a lot in common. I definitely joined the military because of my love of travel as well. My spouse is also a former infantry officer.

Thank you very much for your service. Scott, how about you?

Scott Flesch
I grew up in Long Island, New York. Nobody in my immediate family was in the military. I did have an uncle and grandfather that served and I was just drawn to it because of a sense of purpose.

I had always been involved or interested in the rule of law and politics and democracy, and I just felt that pull towards the military. I applied for an Army ROTC scholarship while in high school, and was awarded it. I chose Catholic University because there was a sense of belonging to the church, but also being in Washington, D.C. since I was a politics major.

Catholic was aligned with Georgetown at the time for Army ROTC. However, it wasn't as convenient as it is today for the cadets. We had to go to Georgetown for all of our classes and our PT sessions. But it definitely built my character while I was here. I enjoyed the four years going back and fourth between Catholic University and Georgetown.

I then did an educational delay to go to law school at the Columbus School of Law at Catholic University and entered the Army Jag Corps in 1998. I served on active duty and in the reserves in numerous positions, and retired as a Major.

The last job I had on active duty was as a trial attorney doing contract litigation on behalf of the Army and various DOD entities. That translated into a civilian job. I went from wearing camouflage  one day to a suit and tie the next, and rose through the ranks in the Army Jag Civilian Corps.

I finished my Army Jag Corps career two years ago and joined a law firm downtown – Miller & Chevalier – as a member. We have three Catholic Law alumni there now. And I'm still practicing government contract litigation. The Army trained me in that very specific area of the law, which I still love.

I loved my Army experience, the sense of purpose it gave me, and I think that the right place for me was here at Catholic University.

Mary Card Mina
Wonderful. Thank you Scott. The two of us go way back. We're both proud double Cardinals, and also join the Army Jag Corps. So it's just wonderful to have you all here for this conversation.

Staying on our theme of service to the nation, can you each share how your military service influenced your work in your respective fields of business, law, and nursing? And this time we’ll start with you, Scott.

Scott Flesch
I think it gave me a sense of purpose, character, and ethics.

There are times – not often – but even in the law, you come across individuals that just don't have those foundational pillars that you want to find in society, in dealing with people and treating them as humans, and understanding ethics and morals. Certainly in the military, that is extremely important when you're dealing with operational law, just war issues, rules of engagement… that is always within the background of, “what's the right thing to do?” Not what you can do, but what's the right choice.

And it's not just operational law. Even in government contracts, you come across choices, right? And with those pillars of do justice, love mercy, walk humbly with your God as your guide, I think I had the right foundational and, ethical background that makes us make the right choices under the right circumstances.

Mary Card Mina
And that is inscribed on the law school building, so what a wonderful quote to share. Alright, Harvey, can you talk about your experience and how your military service has influenced your work in business?

Harvey Seegers
I would say that the two things that I learned most from my military service was to have very high standards with everything that you do and, closely related to that, have patience with different types of learners.

I've now been in academia for, it's hard to believe 11 years, and I always make sure that I'm completely prepared every time I walk into the classroom. And I think the students respond to that.

They know that you've done your homework. As a consequence, they'll do their homework. Every class has a different mixture of learners. Some are very quick learners, some are very slow learners, and you as a teacher have to exercise patience with all kinds. That served me well in the military and it certainly has served me well as a teacher.

Mary Card Mina
You touched on so many amazing points and the military teaches patience for sure. Lots of “hurry up and wait.” And I loved your ideas about being prepared, as well as respecting and understanding differences, whether it's learning styles or in general. So thank you for that.

And Maura, over to you. In terms of nursing, how has your military service influenced your work?

Maura Wenzel
Very similarly to what's already been said, for me, the military gave me a sense of purpose and a sense of value, and it very much went hand-in-hand with being able to serve others as a nurse.

The values of the Navy – honor, courage, and commitment – are really how I approached nursing. I was very fortunate to be a Navy nurse when I was a brand new nurse. It very much went hand-in-hand with how I was approaching myself as a naval officer, as well as being a graduate nurse.

That sense of purpose, that sense of value that you matter. And you do, you matter when you're in the military, and you know that your country needs you and you know that you're the piece of the puzzle that's so important. That also carries through with nursing because every nurse is so important to the patient that they're taking care of.

That had a profound impact on me. So the values that I learned in ROTC were very easily translatable to my work as a nurse.

Scott Flesch
And I think a common theme amongst all of us is the sense of purpose in giving to others. Whether it's mentoring students, or in the military working with Soldiers, it's always giving back and looking to pass on your knowledge and lessons learned, both good and bad, to the future.

And that it's teaching, it's military, it's just even being a lawyer for me, or nurse for you, It's always about the next person up, right?

Leaders eat last. That's a good principle that I think we all follow.
 

Mary Card Mina
And Maura, when you mentioned the importance of each person, and the person in front of you, I also thought about the military and teamwork. And how much teamwork goes into the military. Yeah. I think many people sometimes think of the military as a very hierarchical rank driven society, but it really is about the team.

Maura Wenzel 
It's also the best friends you'll ever make because you just understand what you're in the middle of. My friends who were early Navy nurses together and my friends on deployment, those are the best friends because they understand you're at a different level where you're giving of yourself to serve your country.

It's a camaraderie that's unlike any other.

Mary Card Mina 
Absolutely.

Let's move into our second theme, which is how our experience in the military is combined with faith. I'd like to talk about your approach to leadership, teaching, or mentoring students here at Catholic University, and thus how you also served our Church.

So Harvey, if you could talk a little bit about that, your military combined with your faith and how that shaped your leadership teaching and mentoring.

Harvey Seegers
I'm going to answer that with a story. When I was a second lieutenant stationed in the Philippines going through jungle warfare training, I was in charge of a 210 Marine unit. It came to be a Sunday, and it dawned on me that I probably had more than a handful of Catholics who were in my unit and we weren't near any churches. And so I got on the radio and I called a Navy chaplain that I knew back on base and asked him to fly out and hold Mass in the jungle for however many Catholics there were.

So he got on a helicopter, he flew out to the jungle, set up an altar on a rock in the jungle, and I put word out to my entire unit that we were going to have Mass at one o'clock in the afternoon. And out of the 210 people in my unit, over 100 showed up for a Mass in the jungle.

And from that day forward, I've always thought about making sure that we make time for our students to practice our faith. And I couldn't be happier that in the business school building, Maloney Hall, we have mass at 12:05 every single day of the week. By the way, classes get out at 12 o'clock, so they have five minutes to get to the chapel.

Mary Card Mina 
Thank you for sharing that. That's definitely a beautiful memory and a beautiful story. I can really relate to it, too. I remember so many of the masses that our Catholic chaplain said when deployed. And especially how significant those were. So thank you for sharing that memory.

Maura, can you talk about your experience in the military and how that influence combined with your faith led to your leadership?

Maura Wenzel
Absolutely. Scott already touched on the military and the emphasis on ethics, respect, and courage. I once had a Navy chaplain who was in the hospital that I was working in when I was a new nurse, and he linked spirituality and nursing for me in a way that I guess I hadn't really thought of when I was in undergraduate.

Serving not just the body of the patient, but also the service to the spirit and the mind of the patient. And so seeing that in practice and learning it was okay that, if a patient was stressed out, I could ask if they wanted me to pray for them. And then I just started thinking, “Oh, I can pray for them. It doesn't even matter if I pray with them. I can pray for them.”

I think that I had a very good Navy chaplain when I was a new nurse, and it helped me walk that bridge of being a good Catholic while still being a good officer.

I really dug in deeply with my faith when I was in grad school here at Catholic University. I had come from being stationed in Italy, going to a lot of Masses in Italian. The homilies here when I was in grad school were so phenomenal. Like Harvey said, the opportunity for students to be able to go to Mass and to fill their spiritual cup is something that is so unique to Catholic University and such a gift for our students.

And so I think the military's core commitment and values often go hand-in-hand with how we approach our faith.

Mary Card Mina 
Thank you, Maura. And absolutely, I agree. I think our experience here at Catholic University is definitely a gift.

All right, Scott, over to you.

Scott Flesch
I have a different perspective, very similar, but I'm going to turn it to my profession – the military aspect of it, but also the practice of law.

I'm often struck by the core principles of being a Catholic and also a military officer, and there are principles that underpin Catholicism when it comes to treating everyone equally with compassion, regardless if they're rich, impoverished, Muslim, Jewish, it just doesn't matter. You treat humans with human dignity.

That percolates also into the rules of professional ethics that the military taught me as a young lawyer, as well as just being a lawyer and being licensed in various states and having your ethical requirements.

The jobs I had as a military JAG were amazing. I was defending soldiers accused of crimes, I prosecuted soldiers accused of crimes. Some of the facts were definitely disturbing, but the individual that was either being prosecuted or defended, it was so important to remember my core Catholic teachings of treating everybody with respect. And ensuring that their rights are protected and not judging anybody prematurely. And ensuring that they also felt like you were going to give them your best. That you're going to apply the rules and really act, not just talk a good game about treating people equally, regardless of their background.

Especially in the Army, my perspective is that Soldiers are coming from all walks of life, right? Some have very troubled paths. Some may even have gang affiliation when they were in inner cities. And then you have the exact opposite, you have kids that just want to do something different. You bring all that together into one community – into the military. You have to apply their background, but your core principles and making sure that they're treated equally, appropriately, and that they understand that you are there to assist them. And again, do justice, love mercy, and walk humbly with your God at the same time. Intersecting the military principles, the legal principles, as well as my Catholic upbringing, I really think there's an intersection in ethics and morals, even in the practice of law.

Maura Wenzel
Just to follow up on that, Catholic social doctrine is what we really apply through a lot of our nursing coursework here at Catholic University. When cutting my teeth as a new nurse in the military, it was a perfect scenario. Everyone is treated with equality. Man or woman, you get paid the same across the board.

You know what you can count on and every person's treated with dignity. They don't use these words, but everyone is viewed as a beloved child of God. That's the perception of how you look at every single person, because every single nurse, regardless of where they came from, every corpsman, they were a person who had answered the call to serve their country.

It's very beautiful, and I love that you pulled in that Catholic social teaching of everyone having dignity, because I really do feel that was impressed upon me in the military as well.

Mary Card Mina
Great. Thank you all very much for sharing. I think we've covered this, but I just wanted to circle back around and ask the question in this way, which is connecting both service to nation and service to Church.

Catholic University emphasized this service integrity and formation. How do those values align with the ethos of the military community you were a part of? Maura, we'll start with you this time.

Maura Wenzel
I think I've been very fortunate.

Catholic University has compiled such wonderful colleagues for me to work with, and I would argue, even though I work with two veterans – a former Navy nurse and a former Army nurse – in the undergraduate faculty, I think the overarching theme in my colleagues is that they all have that same ethos.

I'll say honor, courage, and commitment, because I was in the Navy, but the people that Catholic University hires and surrounds their undergraduates with are just top-notch people. I love my colleagues and the values that these faculty members embody. For me, it very much aligns with the ethos of the military community that I was part of it. It almost takes it to another level, because those who pursue teaching and being a faculty member here are obviously going to take their faith very seriously, regardless of if they're Catholic or a Christian.

They take their faith very seriously and they live up to those values and how they teach the students. So it's very much an alignment.

Mary Card Mina
Great, thank you. Harvey, what are your thoughts on this question?

Harvey Seegers
One of the things that always impressed me about the military, and the military across all services, not just the Marine Corps, was how well the organizations developed character. And I see the very same thing here at Catholic University.

I think the faculty and the staff do a wonderful job at emphasizing how important character formation is with our young students and setting a very good example for what character means. I remember very early on in the Marine Corps, I had a drill sergeant who explained to me and to the entire unit that character is the word that explains how you behave when nobody's watching.

And indeed not only did I see that in the Marine Corps, but I see it here where. Students and faculty go out of their way to make sure they're giving the very best, both at the undergraduate level and at the graduate level.

Mary Card Mina
Yeah, absolutely. That was my experience as well.

Scott?

Scott Flesch
Each one of us joined the military on a voluntary basis. So define service, right? Especially when there was a time when service was not voluntary, and will there be a time in the future that its not? Maybe. But people who are at Catholic, especially the cadets…you have to applaud them today because they are choosing to serve on a voluntary basis. And that's becoming a rare commodity these days in society. Hats off to the cadets, the midshipmen, and the airmen, and future airmen and Soldiers and midshipman and sailors at Catholic because they didn't have to do this.

Sure, they may give a scholarship, they may be joining ROTC. But they still had to say yes. And the dedication to country and to some higher purpose certainly has to be applauded. Each one of us did that, and it's going to carry on. And I hope that the University continues to, and I believe it will, support the ROTC programs amongst the various services.

Integrity is doing the right thing when somebody's not watching. To be an officer or an enlisted soldier or airman, you have to always do the right thing. And that was ingrained in me, not only going through my Catholic upbringing but through officer basic school and all the courses I took through the Army JAG Corps: do the right thing and stand for a purpose, and also have the discipline to call yourself out.

We learn from our own mistakes. And to identify and at least admit them, is being human. And sharing those lessons learned with others is critically important, not only to improve their lives, but your own.

When it comes to formation, I think it's self-evident that everything that we've learned here at the University helped form the people that we are in life–professionally and personally. And that ethos and the values that we all talked about today didn't start by themselves. There was no “immaculate development” of an ethos. It's our professors, our parents, our friends, our family, and our coworkers that help shape who we are and our experiences.

It really brought us here today and hopefully teaches some lessons, and it gives some hopefully useful advice to the future to enable and better the lives of others. 

Mary Card Mina
Scott, you talked about lessons learned and I immediately thought of Coach Fisher, who celebrated his Golden Cardinal year. He gave a great talk recently where he said, “It's not win or lose. It's win and learn.” I love that.

This gives a segue into ROTC. Let’s turn our conversation to our third theme: service to Catholic University as faculty members and alumni leaders, and how the University serves veterans and current ROTC students.

So with that, let's talk about the fact that you all have a special connection to Catholic University as both alumni and faculty. In your view, how does Catholic University support military connected students, and where could it continue to grow? Scott, let's start with you.

Scott Flesch
It's just simply supporting them and enabling them to succeed. Whether it's continuing to allow them to take their classes on the University campus or giving them access to transportation. Or when they walk on campus wearing a uniform, thank them for their service. They may not know how to answer honestly, because that is a very personal thing. That's okay. Whatever their answer is–if they say thank you back, or thanks for the appreciation, or just nod, there's no right answer when somebody thanks you for your service–it's just receiving the acknowledgement that they recognize you are again, volunteering in some way to a higher cause in uniform.

Service life is not the easiest thing. I was blessed with it. I had a phenomenal time personally and professionally. I made lifelong friends. But it is not the easiest thing at 6 a.m. to be sweating, rolling in grass on a cool morning.

They all volunteered for that. It is not the easiest thing to be rolling in sawdust after airborne school voluntarily. These are things that not everybody in society chooses to take on. And so our cadets need to be applauded for their service and promise and dedication to the future of giving of themselves.

Any way that we can support them and engage them and then tell them that what they're doing is meaningful and purposeful, we should take that on. 

Mary Card Mina
Great, thank you. Harvey.

Harvey Seegers 
I would say I agree with everything that Scott said. I don't have that much contact–in fact, I have no contact–with the military students that are on campus, and so I can't really render an opinion on how we might be able to engage with them better, but I certainly would welcome the opportunity to get more involved in the future. But in the past, I just haven't.

Mary Card Mina
Thank you. Maura?

Maura Wenzel
Right now, the support that we give happens if they let us know when they have a field training or when they have to be out doing. A lot of times the students will let us know. They'll be like, “Hey, Dr. Wenzel, if I'm late to class, it's because I'm coming from the field.” In general, I think we do a very good job as faculty supporting them.

One thing I think we could do better–in my opinion, so take it for what you will–but perhaps if we had dedicated faculty advisors for the ROTC students so that they don't get lost.

Because some faculty advisors are awesome and they did ROTC and they know what they're going through, but some don't know what it's like to be rolling around, picking ticks off of your legs. I think that would, that's an opportunity for growth that we could have.

Students also end up in my office and they just want to talk about what it was like being a Navy nurse. They want to hear that. If we had more opportunities for them to just be able to talk about it, that would be great. And also, information sessions for people who are not currently in ROTC but potentially may want to join the service.

Scott Flesch
And some additional practical advice–I'm sure the young students are not going to be listening to this podcast, it's probably the Golden Cardinals. So how can you help them actually succeed?

They have a hard enough job getting up early after a night at college, let alone go into classes after physical training. Don't give them pressure to stay out late. If they tell you, “No, I have class,” then support them. Help facilitate their ability to go to sleep.

These are not easy jobs, mixing college and being a cadet. So cut off the peer pressure a little bit and just support them and encourage them to do what they need to do. It's hard enough.

Mary Card Mina
That's a great practical thought for sure. For me, when I was wearing the uniform, I was an adjunct faculty member at the law school. The one thing that the Columbus School of Law did for me was they told me if I was rushing from my day job to get to class and didn’t have time to change, I should feel free to wear my uniform.

I never wore my uniform in class, but I really just appreciated that thought and kindness of supporting my needs. Wear the uniform, if necessary.

Alright, so a slightly different spin on this question. In what ways do you think the alumni community can engage with and support ROTC students and alumni who are currently serving or have served. Over to you, Maura.

Maura Wenzel
I do think perhaps if we could have events at homecoming where former military students could just get together. My husband's always like, “why don't they just do a tailgate?” I don't know if that's appropriate, but I do think having some way where they feel like they can connect with their former classmates who have spread to the four winds, and just have a military appreciation event that would support Cardinals who have served.

And then even mentorship opportunities between alumni and ROTC students. If graduates are willing to come and speak to students, I think that might be helpful.

Mary Card Mina
Great. So I'm gonna turn to Scott. One of the great things the Alumni Association, of which Scott is a prior president of, does is have some grassroots ways that the Veterans Committee is working to support current ROTC students or those who have currently served or are serving. Scott, do you want to share some thoughts?

Scott Flesch 
Sure. And I think the tailgate idea is wonderful.

Mary's not giving herself credit. She started a few initiatives, especially at the Pre-game Tent Party [at Cardinal Weekend]. We've had a veteran's table the last couple years, but we need to do more. We also need more involvement. We should probably get a big old green camouflage tent that people can see a million miles away to have as a central point as folks walk in, and provide some sort of meaningful appreciation for their service.

But what can the everyday person do outside homecoming? It's actually helping identify those people. If you know a Catholic graduate or student that is a veteran or currently serving, it's getting their name into, say, the Veterans Committee for the Alumni Association, so that they can be recognized.

We've done care packages. I remember that Mary and I went to college with, David Shableski–he is a JAG in the National Guard in New Jersey–deployed numerous times. This last time he was in the Middle East and was going back and forth because he was a lieutenant colonel, helping supervise and mentor his own folks. We not only sent him a personal care package, but his unit a care package.

And we didn't just put the cookies and the candy in there. The Catholic University flag was there. We have wonderful pictures, literally in a military operations center, and Catholic University's flag is there. And that's symbolic. It shows that we are trying to give back on a worldwide basis to those who have answered the call.

But it can't stop with one example. You have to continue to identify folks. And Mary, you could tell them about the liaison's office here on campus and how they can raise the need to celebrate a Catholic alum who is deployed.

What should they do? Who should they contact?

Mary Card Mina
Kevin Riley is the new director of military and veteran support. He has just started his role here and is very engaged in supporting not only students, but also veterans.

I've talked with him at length about different ideas. The list of names of veterans that we met at Cardinal Weekend, for example. I've connected those individuals to Kevin. They'll be doing some informal mentoring. Actually, three of the alumni that I met were all nurses, so there's a very strong tradition of military and nursing.

So yes, Kevin Riley is a great point of contact.

Scott Flesch
And, there is a big need. There is one thing that we have identified that I will personally call upon the alumni and the University to support in a meaningful manner. And it is the veteran's memorial [on campus]. You may not know where it is because it's actually hidden behind bushes in front of McMahon Hall.

It is in desperate need of renovation. There's such an opportunity to make it something that recognizes all of the veterans at Catholic University and where they served, when they served, and leaving growth for the future for the echelons and generations of Cardinals that will serve. There is a need to organize a campaign, and then obviously there's gonna be a need to donate.

We have preliminary plans in place to start that effort. We've identified the likely cost of that project and it just needs to get off the ground in a meaningful way. And then people need to start giving and alumni need to step up.

If you're listening to this podcast and want to know more about it, please reach out to the Alumni Association or the advancement office so you can give back and give the veteran memorial a meaningful spot, something that is more than a stone behind some bushes.

Because honestly, to me, that's a travesty. It doesn't recognize the service and dedication that so many Catholic University alums have given over the years, including their lives.

Mary Card Mina
Thank you, Scott. And also two other things, depending on when you're listening to this Veteran's Day Cardinal Perspectives conversation.

For many years, we have supported Wreaths Across America. We will be in six cities and alumni can join in that ceremony on December 13, 2025. Volunteer information will be coming out.

Speaking of wreaths, we recently held our first wreath laying ceremony. President Kilpatrick, Mrs. Kilpatrick, and two ROTC cadets laid a wreath at the tomb of the Unknown Soldier at Arlington National Cemetery–again reinforcing Catholic University's commitment to both service to church and nation.

As Scott mentioned, there are things that we are doing, but there's always a lot more that we could do and we certainly need your help.

So as this is a Veteran's Day edition, I just wanted to turn and wish you all a, “Happy Veteran's Day,” and as we close, give you time to just say either your favorite story as a veteran or any closing comments that you would like to make. And Maura, we'll start with you.

Maura Wenzel
One of my favorite stories about being in the military was when I got back from deployment. If I have to be honest, I had been acting as a nurse in the Navy taking care of our service members and their family members and those who were retired, but it wasn't until I actually deployed and then came back that I had such a profound sense of pride of having served my country.

And I think that my deployment changed how I looked not only at service to my country, it changed how I looked at nursing in general, and it just made me really proud that I had joined the Navy as a nurse.

So I don't have one specific moment, but I would say my absolute pride in having served my country and my delight at teaching here at Catholic University.

Mary Card Mina
Awesome. Thank you and happy Veterans Day early.

Harvey?

Harvey Seegers
Mary, thanks for asking the question because I do have a favorite story and it's one I've been telling in the classroom for the last 10 years.

So, I’m stationed with the Sixth Fleet and we are coming off shore leave in Hong Kong. We all get aboard ship. And when you're traveling as a fleet unit, all the ships, including the submarines and the planes, leave port in formation. And so we're a few miles out of the Hong Kong Harbor and I'm down in the officer's mess having lunch.

And lo and behold, the man overboard alarm sounds. Now, not only does the ship that I'm on have to stop, the entire Sixth Fleet has to stop in the Pacific Ocean, outside the Hong Kong Harbor. Shortly after we stopped, the onboard loudspeaker announced, “Lieutenant Seegers, come to the Captain's quarters.”

So I make my way up the ship and go to the Captain's quarters. Standing at the front door of the Captain's quarters is my radio man. He's soaking wet and underneath his left arm is a basketball. And what do I come to find out? That my radio man, who was born and raised on American Samoa and was a cliff diver, was up on the flight deck playing basketball. Somebody took a shot with a bad rebound. It went off the flight deck, and he didn't miss a beat.

He ran to the side of the ship and did a swan dive into the Hong Kong Harbor to retrieve the basketball. And when I asked him why he did that, he said, “Lieutenant, it was the last basketball aboard the ship.”

Mary Card Mina
Oh my goodness. That is great. Thank you very much for sharing that. And you have to tell the basketball team that story if you haven't already.

Scott?

Scott Flesch
That's hard to top. I'll just say this, as a University, we're instilled with certain values, and on this Veteran's Day, you could talk a good game, you could say you appreciate and express gratitude, but we do more than lip service. We are graduates of The Catholic University of America.

Act on your hopes, your intentions, and your appreciation. Do more than just pay lip service. Service to your nation is something that is critically important to our survival and to democracy. It is who we are. It's ingrained in your soul, and you have to do more than just talk about it.

Mary Card Mina
Thank you. And Harvey, happy Veterans Day to you. Scott, happy Veterans Day to you, as well.

I think I would like to close by talking about our family members because they also serve and especially on Veteran's Day, I think of them.

One of my son's memories, and he still talks about it, was when he was given a military child award at my retirement. And it was important to me that he received that award. So a special thanks and a happy Veteran's Day to all of the military children that are listening, all of the military spouses that have sacrificed their career to follow their loved ones that have served as both mother and father through deployments and all of the roles and all of the things.

I am grateful for my family that supported my military career, and I think so many of my memories and great stories are wrapped up with them because I would not have been able to have those experiences but for them.

Again, a huge happy Veterans Day to all. Thank you very much for sharing your stories. And this concludes our Veterans Day edition of Cardinal Perspectives.

Thank you.